hardware or software?!

[ketsarku Profile]

hi there!

i'm a newbie on the fields of producing electronic music (breakcore - drill and bass - ambient - 8 bit etc) and i have no idea what i really need to create this sound..

i went to a music store and the seller told me that i need these things..
laptop
MOTU UltraLite
M-Audio Axiom-25
Akai MPD-24
Native Instruments Battery 3
Korg Kaoss Pad 3

as you can see.. a lot of expensiv stuff for a bloody beginner. i've chatted with some other producer and they said, all that i really need is renoise, reason, battery 3 and a computer.

so.. i'm confused. please help me. ^^ if you got any questions, iw will answer them as soon as possible.

cheerio! hail to the break!

[Higgins Profile]

This is a topic i discuss very often with fellow advocates of hardware in electronic music. For most types of electronic music you can survive solely on hardware if you have the proper gear and skill. Now, unless your recording something like ambient ( i guess) your a fool not to use a computer. If you need to or want to edit the micro structure of you song and not just the macro structure, you need a computer. Now if you are or were a hardware purist, realize what I did. You can go and record all of your sounds and drums and breaks and synth parts or whatever it may be on hardware or independently from the computer but you have to have to have to piece it together edit it and perhaps even master it on the computer. This is of course for something precise as breakcore. Now from the looks of the gear you already have, with a sequencer your fine. I would personally say go spend a little more cash if you can and get something like logic, cubase, ableton ( if you really got the cash). if not and you like hexi-decimals go with renoise. Good luck, and I hope I will be able to hear your stuff soon!

-higgins aka art holiday

[Silent Frog Profile]

Just get a demo of Renoise or Ableton (or both) and check them out before committing to anything. If you really need to get any hardware to get you started, go on ebay and get yourself a cheap midi contoller. For the VSTs you'll probably be using, having knobs to twist and faders to fade(?) will make things easier but only that. It won't add anything to your sound until you know what you are doing with the software.

[the shallow stairs Profile Website]

yea, man, when i was starting out, i didn't know my ass from my head in hardware or software...

well now that higgins and i are working together on producing breakcore, jungle, and trip-hop, we are using cubase, at the moment, for cutting/speeding up breaks, then he's got traktor3 with a midi controller and he mixes the beats, whilst i use a numark tt200 turntable and 1050 mixer to scratch, skip, cut, and cue the melody, just using dj tricks

hope i've helped, and hey, just make music you like, keep it evil

[ketsarku Profile]

hey guys.. thanks for responding!
so far, i've got NONE of the hardware/software listed in the frist post by now. just the computer.
i'm going to test renoise (it looks very weird.. hail the tutorials!) and reason 4.

tracker and synthesizer.. i guess..
i don't know which of these programm are used for what reason but.. hell, i'll figure it out somehow. O_o what about the vst? (virtual studio technology) i don't get it..

i'm just hoping, that this stuff gets in my head real fast..

[PEPCORE]

I agree with everybody here, you should first try out some trial versions of everything, and not spend massive amounts of money on shit you might not want to use in the future.

[xTxRxAxVxIxSx Profile Website]

I'm in the same boat as ketsarku, basically.

I want to make the jump from just software to software/hardware, maybe even eventually just hardware. For myself, I've picked out the MicroKorg and the Korg KAOSS Pad 3 - buying them probably next month. As for software, I primarily use FL Studio, but I'm starting to get to know Ableton. Also have Reason, but it really doesn't seem like much fun without some controllers. I also need to check out Renoise sometime...

Don't have a clue about MIDI interfaces, though. Or mixers/anything like that. I'll probably just be playing my shit through my brother's guitar amp for a while until I can afford some of that stuff.

From my very little experience, I say: if you have the money to get some of this stuff, give it a shot - worst case scenario, you tire of it and sell it off to somebody on eBay or something.

[the shallow stairs Profile Website]

i use hardware/software, have a laptop that i run renoise on, then i use a numark tt200 for samples/scratching and melody, a piece of shit mixer, numark 1050 (gonna buy a rane), and then i want to buy a midi controller...

[PEPCORE]

I'm in the same boat as ketsarku, basically.

I want to make the jump from just software to software/hardware, maybe even eventually just hardware. For myself, I've picked out the MicroKorg and the Korg KAOSS Pad 3 - buying them probably next month. As for software, I primarily use FL Studio, but I'm starting to get to know Ableton. Also have Reason, but it really doesn't seem like much fun without some controllers. I also need to check out Renoise sometime...

Don't have a clue about MIDI interfaces, though. Or mixers/anything like that. I'll probably just be playing my shit through my brother's guitar amp for a while until I can afford some of that stuff.

From my very little experience, I say: if you have the money to get some of this stuff, give it a shot - worst case scenario, you tire of it and sell it off to somebody on eBay or something.

I'm the same as you too, i'm all about software now, but wanna get me some hardware, and i use fl too , ableton, i dont get at all

[PEPCORE]

I've now narrowed down my choises too:

M Audio Axiom 25:
http://feedback.nl/?b=AXIOM25&a=186

Emu Xboard 25
http://feedback.nl/?b=EXBOARD25&a=186

What would you guys buy, if its your first midi/usb controller?




Gr33tzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Silent Frog Profile]

I was planning on getting the Axiom a while back but I went for the Novation ReMote 25 LE instead: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/oct06/a ... vation.htm

It's got loads of assignable buttons and knobs plus a pretty handy X/Y Touchpad. The keyboard is really nice to play aswell. Howeve, I got mine secondhand and one of the knobs is pretty temperamental and I've heard the build quality isn't great but it is dirt cheap compared to its competitors. I think It's been discontinued now but should be easy to find on ebay for a decent price.

[PEPCORE]

Yeah i was thinking about that one too.
http://feedback.nl/?b=NRMTLE&a=

But its 40 euros more expensive then the e-mu x board 25, and 30 euros cheaper then the axiom 25, still dont know whats the best buy.

Ahh well think i still have to learn more about them.

The axiom looks very nice though:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTEq2uSEbyY

But i think i still might go for the e-mu xboard 25, since its the cheapest.

I'm still thinking, should i buy the cheapest one, the e-mu x board 25, or should i go with something a bit better like the axiom.

Decisions, decisions..........

[silver4 Profile]

As hardware,i have: Clavia Nord modular 1,Dave Smith's Evolver desktop,korg electribes er-1,esx-1,Waldorf Pulse,Yamaha DX-7 mk2 (floppy),MFB synth lite.

All of the above replaced with: Ableton live+ Renoise,running freewares and:Reaktor,Surge,FM8,Shortcircuit,Zebra,controlled by korg PADKontrol and Axiom 61.
Without any regrets.Soundwise or controlling wise.

When live,i used hardwares,but only for the public's sake,i hate the way i work with (the above)hardware versus the softwares(z)/controllers.
That's the way electronic music is...live sucks,unless you have a bassist and a vocal in the band,and lots of fancy lights-or you play really good music.
The fact i was turning knobs on my Modular versus knobs on my Axiom makes no difference for me,i hate knobs anyway(love sliders),but the trend is: "It's cooler if you don't have a laptop".Oh yeah? Man if i see ANOTHER live gig with some fingered kaosspad and head-shaking over the Electribe....c'mon.This is precise,microscopic editing,COMPUTER music.
Don't want that to strip the computer of all the credits because,well,it's not cool ,every house wife has one as well.
Well,it's not cool to pretend you're turning knobs on a synth eighter,live.What,you're making those 1/96 retriggers by hand?or 9xx commands?Aaaa,they're rendered,but hey,let's be cool and instead of triggering them inside Live,or Renoise,let's trigger them from MPC-1000!It's HARDWARE.
No offend intended to anyone,just sharing from my experience.My intention is not to diss the hardware at all,but the trend that dictates that having only a laptop/midi controller is not cool live,yet having a kaoss pad/Electribe automatically is.Same static person,only with a laptop you don't have to pretend you're changing something every fk milisecond on that mixer.
Cheers
ok,to sweeten things a bit,here's a piece of hardware no one can be mad of:Metasonix all-vacuum G-1000 Amp "The Fucking Fucker "
[http://www.metasonix.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=36&Itemid=67&PHPSESSID=cbcdd016bb08785fcca816ebfffea739][/url]

[PEPCORE]

Ok, you got a lot then, but i wanna know, where did you start, you say you use ableton, what did you start with, i mean what is the best hardware to begin with?

I don't wanna make a misbuy ya know, money doesn't grow in the overfertilized streetcorner.

[silver4 Profile]

Of course you don't want to make a misbuy.Like I did.
Let me share some experiences with the hardware i have versus the softs.I'm talking from the perspective of a idm/glitch/ producer.
The nord modular sounds in the same category as nowadays softs like massive or zebra,only it doesn't have efx like reverb or delay,or any memory for samples..The newer one,the G2,has them but are weak versus plugs like convolution reverbs etc.
The editor is VERY nice compared with reaktor 5.But reaktor is king in sample manipulation,so it kills the NM in that regard.
The Waldorf Pulse has indeed a very DEEP bass,but not that far away from vsti's like MINIMONSTA or even Taurus to justify buying it..
The Evolver got SO MUCH praise i had to buy it blindly.It's a pain in the ass to edit things in that little desktop synth.Sounds a little fuller/natural when i use analog oscilattors.The delay is shit.The distort is shit.
Electribes:..everyone knows them,i'm sick of them.
DX7 versus FM8...c'mon.
SO ,for the hardware part,what i'm really fond of is the Korg PADKontrol.Really love the thing.I trigger Ableton Drum racks with it.Good piece of gear.
There are (much) better gear than i have.I really dig the Vermona Perfourmer bass.Elektron Monomachine and Machine drum seems really hot.And they are,at 1600 eur a piece.Never listened them personally,only Youtube..
My personal conclusion is Ableton-or cubase-or logic-Renoise(any of them really,doesn't matter that much) coupled with a few good new gen vsti's and vst efx, can output excellent sound quality.Finding a good midi controller to suit your personal style helps a lot.As does a good soundcard and a decent pair of monitors.
I don't think any sequencer really has an edge over others because in my experience,if you really want an original,smart track,you must do all the edits by hand.Things like Glitch vst will kill your personal,original style.Avoid.
I listened to some traks posted here and i loved them,I know many are done with only Renoise or ableton.Really good tracks.
I think Breakcore and it's "brothers" really thrive in computer environement.
Spending all that money on my gear ,i learned 1 important thing:
-If ,in a review site,where users can share their thoughts about the respective gear(like sonicstate.com)-you find 500 posts saying "man,this is da shit,it's unbelievebelelblah blah...etc" and ONE post saying "man,i think this synth has weak oscillators and filter",then that one is right and the 500 ones are wrong.
Cheers